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Rogue Trader

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Re: Rogue Trader

Postby Quicksilver » Mon Jun 06, 2016 3:20 pm

Unfortunately, the 40k line uses Black Libraries old d100 system. It's completely different set up. Fate is definitely the simpler system, while FFG's EotE has more nuances to it. It'll depend on people's familiarities. And if they want a crunchier system.

The solidarity thing is referring, really, to how 'all behind you' your crew, minions and employees are. If we deemphasize it, the players can assume that unless something dramatic is happening, your crew are doing their best to support you, your managers aren’t embezzling (excessively) and generally the people under you are trying to help you succeed. If it's emphasized, then morale and managing payout becomes a bigger deal. Subversion is something to be looked out for, as well as upstarts who play less than fair with their comrades. Keeping your house in order becomes part of the game.

As for characters, one can think of the options as being nearly anyone you might find on the command staff of a capital ship or the upper levels of a major corporation.

And yes, that is one thing I kinda left off - we do need to figure out which player is actually holding the Warrant of Trade, ie, is the Rogue Trader/President/CEO/Big Boss.
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Re: Rogue Trader

Postby Grimgit » Mon Jun 06, 2016 5:37 pm

I'm one of the folks Quicksilver contacted from another area and I'm also interested (if somewhat tardy)
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Re: Rogue Trader

Postby ShadoWarrior » Mon Jun 06, 2016 6:12 pm

Quicksilver wrote:Unfortunately, the 40k line uses Black Libraries old d100 system. It's completely different set up. Fate is definitely the simpler system, while FFG's EotE has more nuances to it. It'll depend on people's familiarities. And if they want a crunchier system.

I'm for crunchy. I prefer nuanced over "dumbed-down". There's nothing wrong with Fate, per se. But I think that FFG's EotE is a better system than Fate. However, unless everyone has access to one of FFG's Star Wars RPG core books (either purchased or pirated), then I guess we'll likely be using Fate.

On a related topic, does Orokos (or any other site) support Fate dice? For a PbP, having the support of an online dice roller may be a key deciding factor.

Spoiler:
[off-topic rant]
Speaking of dumbed down, Hearts of Iron 4, which just came out today, really annoys me. Streamlining the game by taking away much of what made HoI 3 a great game is frustrating. Granted, it is far easier to learn and get started in, so it may appeal to a broader base, but I doubt that the overall impact on Paradox's sales will be positive. The grognards that like micromanagement games like HoI are going to be more pissed off than they are pleased by the changes.
[/rant]

Quicksilver wrote:And yes, that is one thing I kinda left off - we do need to figure out which player is actually holding the Warrant of Trade, ie, is the Rogue Trader/President/CEO/Big Boss.

It should be a player that, ideally, is already familiar with playing RT, shouldn't it? Failing that, then it should go to someone who really wants the job, and has the time to do it justice (IOW, someone who's eager and has plenty of time to post often).
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Re: Rogue Trader

Postby ShadoWarrior » Mon Jun 06, 2016 6:13 pm

Grimgit wrote:I'm one of the folks Quicksilver contacted from another area and I'm also interested (if somewhat tardy)

Welcome! Better a wee bit late than never, and you're not really late at all.
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Re: Rogue Trader

Postby swrider » Mon Jun 06, 2016 6:28 pm

I didn't realize they were the same system. In that case I prefer ffg which I already know.
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Re: Rogue Trader

Postby ShadoWarrior » Mon Jun 06, 2016 6:40 pm

swrider wrote:I didn't realize they were the same system. In that case I prefer FFG which I already know.

Actually, QS just said that FFG's RT system isn't the same system as FFG uses for Star Wars. I mistakenly thought it was. RT apparently uses an older, and very different, system. No funky dice, no Destiny mechanics, none of what makes the FFG Star Wars skill check mechanics such a great storytelling mechanism.
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Re: Rogue Trader

Postby Potato » Tue Jun 07, 2016 3:00 am

Another minor thing to consider is if we want to be serious or silly. It's related to the grim vs adventure axis, slighty, but it's worthy of consideration. See, as the existence of the Orks shows, 40k can either be grim and serious or roll about in its own insanity like a deranged puppy and be utterly, gloriously, unrepentantly stupid. So, are we aiming for a straight-laced campaign, or Captain Hercules Lucullus Skywalker Master-Commander Poirot? Yes, that was an actual PC name. I recommend looking him up.

Personally, I feel the straight laced approach works better for PbP, but it would be remiss not to mention that side of Rogue Trader.
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Re: Rogue Trader

Postby ShadoWarrior » Tue Jun 07, 2016 3:11 am

I'm afraid that I'll have to vote for uptight, er, serious. First, silliness gets old, quick. Second, I agree that silliness does not mesh well with online text-based gaming.
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Re: Rogue Trader

Postby Quicksilver » Tue Jun 07, 2016 10:25 am

Welcome Gringit! You are not late, but fashionably on time. Please, feel free to jump into the conversation.

Yeah, I really wish that FFG had migrated their 40k over to a Star-Wars like system when they went into second edition (like they did for Warhammer Fantasy). But we are not so lucky. I personally like the Star-Wars system better, but Shado is correct that unless everyone has access to at least one of the core books it will be significantly more difficult.

I also have to lean on the more serious side. While I enjoy humorous moments, I agree that silly is harder on PbP, and I find tends to lose people depending on which track they take.
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Re: Rogue Trader

Postby Potato » Tue Jun 07, 2016 2:01 pm

I have an.. idea. What about letting one of the people new to the setting take the stage? Letting them be the Rogue Trader? Yes, they won't know much, but it's a pretty good way to learn, what with a bunch of players experienced with the setting acting as IC and OOC advisors.

Either way, till we have a Rogue Trader settled and idea of who their character is, I'll withhold from the finer details of character creation. A cold-hearted profiteer demands a different officer corps to a altruistic man of the Creed.
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Re: Rogue Trader

Postby Grimgit » Tue Jun 07, 2016 2:09 pm

I'm happy to have a game with moments of levity though I think that an all silly all the time game is difficult to do.

That said one of the characters I would consider playing is a Prince George style Rogue Trader who is just really the name and the bank account. His advisers carefully 'interpret' his commands to ensure that the correct action is taken.

Other potential characters could be:
Rebuilt missionary who is dedicated to the Omissia
Ork Freebooter (because paradoxically I find one Ork actually works as the straight man rather than the comedy relief)

What sort of characters are we actually looking for?
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Re: Rogue Trader

Postby Carch » Tue Jun 07, 2016 5:58 pm

heya quicksilver. i guess you'll recognize the name (and character, maybe?)

I do still like my astropath from the 40k thing on nationstates, could play as Melor. or. I could go with the backup character i thought up back then. A false man explorator going for master of ordnance. didn't think too much about his backstory, was having too muc fun with the astropath. but basically a explorator rebuilt to be the "perfect" master of ordnance from a adeptus mechanicus viewpoint. how exactly to express that I don't know yet. XD

also, I would agree with potatoes idea, having someone not as deeply vested in 40k being the rogue trader is a great idea. since it'd also mean that nobody is left behind because all the others are in on some piece of lore.

oh, and since I guess nobody here really knows me, I'm a pretty big 40k lore fan, but specialize heavily in adeptus mechanicus.
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Re: Rogue Trader

Postby swrider » Tue Jun 07, 2016 9:24 pm

if the idea is for one of us new people to play the rogue trader, perhaps we could get a little more information about what that entails and what the options are. At least from the other players GM perspective.
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Re: Rogue Trader

Postby Alstair07 » Tue Jun 07, 2016 10:33 pm

Game System: No strong preferences here, is willing to work with anything I can access to have some clarity on rules.

Game Direction: War with another Rogue Trader or crew struggles can be rather interesting. Considering republican feuds of old, Rogue Traders' war is much more sophisticated and can involve bribing of crew, magistrates of settlements, good producers, etc.

The Dynasty: I would be honest with you if I said I wanted to play cybernatically enhanced navigator.

Roots of the Dynasty: leaving this to the Captain of our ship!
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Re: Rogue Trader

Postby Potato » Wed Jun 08, 2016 3:00 am

swrider wrote:if the idea is for one of us new people to play the rogue trader, perhaps we could get a little more information about what that entails and what the options are. At least from the other players GM perspective.


The Rogue Trader is the head of the Dynasty. You're the boss and the buck stops with you. You're the one who orders everyone around, hires and fires guys and generally the guy who makes the big negotiations, like buying ships and negotiating trade routes... although if you'd rather take a break from that you can delegate. That's the biggest perk, really. You can send other people, even other players, to talk to someone you'd rather not.

Other perks of the job include having some of the best access to the shiniest gear cause you're rich and you gotta look the part. Power swords, plasma pistols... Good stuff. Also did I mention you're rich? Even at relatively low levels of wealth your mission briefings can take place over a five course meal. It's good to be a Rogue Trader. You own the ship, the Warrant of Trade lets you get away with a LOT of things that would normally see you punished in Imperial society... yeah. That said, there are limits, and the health and prosperity of the rest of the PCs and your crew is kiiinda in your hands. Oh well!

Oh, right, the Warrant of Trade. Okay so, here's the basic premise:

The Koronus Expanse is, more or less, Space Wild West. It's massively unexplored and uncharted, with human colonies never discovered since the Imperium lost contact with them thousands of years ago. The Imperium, cause there is only war and the only good alien is a dead alien, is too busy fighting literally everyone to properly colonise, explore, build and police this region of space. Therefore, they have taken to simply garrisoning the nearest parts of it and leaving the rest to anyone who wants to try and make something of it.

Enter the Rogue Traders! These influential and powerful people have been drawn to the Expanse by just how unknown it is, and by what profits may be found out there. The Imperium, massively over worked as it is, basically throws their hands up, hands them a fancy document called the Warrant of Trade, and says "go hog wild. And uh, remain faithful to the Imperial Creed and stuff." Quite a few of the Rogue Traders... take some liberties with that last part. Anyway, these warrants are kept and inherited by their descendants, while new ones are written and doled out regularly. The result is that the Expanse is more or less a collection of hyper-rich dynasties competing to find the countless secrets still hidden on its many worlds. And best part is that there's still a lot of unclaimed territory. Like... a LOT. Plenty of room to lay down new claims if you'd like.

Oh, and statwise, the Rogue Trader is the party face. They are the best at command and smooth talking, and in the RT system have a bunch of cool perks they can take, as well as starting with the ability to give a fellow officer a bonus on their next roll as a free action every turn. They're also decent at melee combat, because what kind of leader in 40k DOESN'T have a sword or other melee weapon? That's the 1d100 system, mind, not Fate, so I can't really guarantee that this will translate exactly.
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Re: Rogue Trader

Postby Quicksilver » Wed Jun 08, 2016 7:41 am

To expound/clarify what Potato said:

The Imperium, for all it's size, does not cover the entirely of the galaxy. Because of the dangers and horrors of what may (and does) lay beyond these borders, the Imperium forbids its citizens from (under normal circumstances) from going beyond it's borders, regulating them to safe and known warp routes between settled and secure planets. And for many ship captains, limited to only a handful of those.

A Rogue Trader is, by it's most basic and essential definition, the bearer of a Warrant of Trade. A Warrant of Trade is a legal document that is inheritable and held by a single individual at any time. The Warrant allows for a few very specific things. First, it allows the barer and those under his or her command to travel anywhere within and beyond boarders of the Imperium. Second, it grants the right of exploitation of the resources found outside the Imperium, both by resource extraction and by colonization. Third, it allows the barer to own a remarkable amount of millitary forces and hardwear, including being given command of Imperial Forces. Fourth, it grants a certain amount of immunity to both local laws and some Imperial Laws, most notably communication with Aliens (or xenos as they're commonly referred to) and possession of un-cleared alien artifacts.

Disney has a song that will give you a good feel. In this case, the Dynasty would be the Virginia Company.

In all cases, ultimate authority rests in and comes from the Rogue Trader. Everyone else is allowed to do what they do because they are under the Rogue Trader's command and/or acting in his or her name. This is the essential, immutable function of the Rogue Trader. They are the president and owner of their company.

Now we move into convention:

Although a few Rogue Traders rest on their laurels and dispatch ships carefully from their mansions, stories are rarely told of them. A Most Rogue Traders take directly to the leadership of their missions of exploration and exploitation in the uncharted regions. They are almost universally of noble bearing, if not noble upbringing, and have leading, charismatic personas. At the edge of the imperium, reputation is as important as wealth.

Due to the commonality of both dueling and personal leading of boarding actions, skill with pistols and melee weapons is typical. Because they have the final authority, other powerful individuals are likely to want to speak directly with them, which makes willpower important. They are often called upon to inspire their crew, civilians and potential investors. Many also take direct command of their flagship, and/or direct command of their forces.

Out there, there is a Rouge Trader who does almost everything. But the must successful Rogue Traders also know how to hire exceptionally skilled advisors & officers, and when to listen to them.




On the rules note, does anyone not have access to Edge of the Empire, Age of Rebellion or Force and Destiny?

Also, Hi Carch, good to see you. :)

Lastly, if anyone likes Capital Ships and Star Wars, check out Shadowarrior's Far Orbit Project on this board.
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Re: Rogue Trader

Postby swrider » Wed Jun 08, 2016 8:31 am

So basically it is a privateer with a letter of marque mixed with an explorer. The letter of marque in this case being against Xenos and disloyal rogue traders.

Shado,
you have been playing a face character recently in my Fight or Flight Game would you prefer that I take the role of rogue trader in this game. I am fine with either option so you get to pick. (I think we are the only two new players)
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Re: Rogue Trader

Postby ShadoWarrior » Wed Jun 08, 2016 8:48 am

I'd prefer not to play the face in this game too. It's going to be enough work for me to learn this game, plus manage all of the games that I GM; I don't need to add being responsible for all the NPCs and the well-being of my fellow trade crew on top of that. Thanks for the offer.
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Re: Rogue Trader

Postby ShadoWarrior » Wed Jun 08, 2016 8:50 am

Quicksilver wrote:Lastly, if anyone likes Capital Ships and Star Wars, check out Shadowarrior's Far Orbit Project on this board.

Thanks for the unsolicited plug! That game could certainly use plenty more players.
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Re: Rogue Trader

Postby swrider » Wed Jun 08, 2016 8:54 am

Lol, I guess that leaves me.

So... I am open to suggestions for the dynasty. I would prefer to be a new rogue trader (perhaps recently inherited the warrant of trade and am stepping into (or promoted from) an established crew.

I like the idea of a battleship turned into a freighter and exploration colony development. I am not opposed to war perhaps we are trying to reclaim a lost colony or something like that.

If we are using FFG's Star Wars system I will really only be able to specialize in one maybe two areas unless we start at a higher xp. It appears face skills are the most important so I will need trusted advisors for technical operations, tactical operations, and security at a minimum.
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Re: Rogue Trader

Postby Quicksilver » Wed Jun 08, 2016 10:09 am

Alright, awesome, this is a good place to start! And thank you for taking on the role.

An important and valuable note - in the imperium (and 40k universe in general) information tends to be horded, and dissemination of information is minimal, particularly outside your preserved scope and station. So for a young(er) imperial individual to not actually know a lot about how things really are on is very much in world. Even more so if the former head of the family (ie, previous Rogue Trader in your dynasty) died unexpectedly and before he or she could finish your training. (such as taking you on as an apprentice, et al)

Battleships, being among the largest (human) craft in the galaxy, are beyond the means even of most Rogue Traders. Just maintaining it is going to take a large amount of your capital. As part of "starting position" the battleship will not be in great shape, but usable. However, just having a battleship, even if it's not fully equipped or developed, is a grand statement.

Although there are other possibilities, the a battleship as your vessel likely came about in one of two ways. First, if yours is a very old dynasty, it may be the long standing flagship of your house. Your family may have fell on hard times and had to partly strip it to make ends meet or cut costs. Alternately it might have been all-but-destroyed in a recent battle. Either way, at its heart it is still the ancient vessel your ancestors have used for many, many generations.

Or, if your family is young, the capture or recovery of a long lost or damaged battleship may have been the capstone in whatever endeavor projected your family enough into the limelight to be granted a shiny new warrant of trade. It may have been captured from the enemy and just sanctified (cleared for service), or your family may have funded lifting it from the planet it crashed-landed on centuries (or millennia) ago.

(By the way, 40k Battleships are really big. Like this big.)

You also touched on exactly why Rogue Traders hire skilled allies/advisors/officers – there is way too much for them to be skilled at everything. (although some will try)
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Re: Rogue Trader

Postby Carch » Wed Jun 08, 2016 10:19 am

what could also work. depending on if bred wants a more guiding hand in our storyline, is that our rogue trader character is actually the oldest son of the true holder of the warrant.

any rogue trader with children will often involve the more promising ones in his endevours, or even just give them a ship as a subordinate of his enterprise and let them go to see which one survives/would be the best to inherit the warrant.

this would allow us less freedom, but would also give us more possible support and/or the possibility of using a ship better suited to a role from his father's fleet. if we smooth-talk enough to make it seem nessesary.

it would be harder on bredtonia though to manage all that.


as for the dynasty. we could even be a truly 'new' dynasty. part of imperial politics is that at the very, very top a good way to get rid of someone is to somehow get them given a warrant of trade, something that is impossible to refuse, and which means they have to go out in a ship beyond the borders of the imperium. a warrant of trade does almost always come with a ship and some military force, and could be a good way of introducing the rather low-tech way imperial ships operate at times to a new lord-captain.

also, a battleship? I would personally go for a dauntless, a endevour or a sword. (light cruiser, light cruiser, frigate). battleships will take a LOT of maintenance, and are perhaps not the best choice to take into fullly uncharted space. sure we can put a serious dent in any planet that looks at us funny, but If we want to do some exploring something a bit nimbler and more able to avoid asteroid belts might be in order.
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Re: Rogue Trader

Postby Quicksilver » Wed Jun 08, 2016 10:29 am

(hey Carch, it's Quicksilver here, not Bred/bredtonia - that's my nationstates nation :P )

Yes, a battleship is highly impractical in many cases, but don't let that stop you if it seems like fun - we can make (nearly) anything work. And yes, being the child of a retired/semi-retired off screen warrent holder is also a possiblity.
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Re: Rogue Trader

Postby Carch » Wed Jun 08, 2016 10:32 am

ah, sorry. feel a bit strange today. will try to remember.
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Re: Rogue Trader

Postby swrider » Wed Jun 08, 2016 10:33 am

what are the other options besides battle ship? is there something more link a cruiser. armed but smaller meant to play an escort roll originally.
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